Random Teams CyK - Drex vs Crispickle

[Juan]

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it's not that he loses 36k to some assault, it's that he orders 36k to strictly and simply claim/defend the hill

end game will come almost immediately since drex sent 90% of his army to the island. he should be moving out to reinforce a kou and gyou'un as soon as he catches wind of drex sending the vast majority of his troops there.

wait, drex really does waste 36k men and one of his GGs for pure defending.

i'd contest the second point, but wasting ghm is just

[Crispickle]

[DreX]

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i really doubt zen ou can completely stop them and their 30k with only 10k

And about this, even though i said the Zeno clan isn't my main working force, technically speaking, for each zeno clan member to take down 3 Moubu men is a very realistic assumption without exaggeration, when they're taken by surprise and when they're already being dealt with from the front.

You treat the matchups in this battle as if it's a direct confrontation. If it was, i'd lose, i'm playing strategy, and whether it's playing a defensive battle on a shore while the enemies are trying to cross the river or when i ambush them suddenly, i'm having an undoubtful strategical advantage at literally all the battle fields.

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wait, drex really does waste 36k men and one of his GGs for pure defending.

i'd contest the second point, but wasting ghm is just

[Crispickle]

wow ... literally ... wasting GHM ? pure defence? ... i'm lost for words...

I can only tell you one thing, in a battle with the win condition being either reaching an advantage stalemate or defeating the enemy with raw force, with my team, i'd be playing a losing battle if i attempted to win with raw force, hence, i'm going for another alternative.

I don't waste them by using them for defence, on the contrary, i'm having a very advantageous position which i don't wanna abandon, and GHM fortifying the hill is the core of my plan. If i took a complete control over the hill as the battles underneath are still at a stalemate, it'd be my win. there's nothing wrong with playing defensive .

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it's not that he loses 36k to some assault, it's that he orders 36k to strictly and simply claim/defend the hill

end game will come almost immediately since drex sent 90% of his army to the island. he should be moving out to reinforce a kou and gyou'un as soon as he catches wind of drex sending the vast majority of his troops there.

I can't say you make much sense to me tbh. can you make your point clearer?

[Juan]

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And about this, even though i said the Zeno clan isn't my main working force, technically speaking, for each zeno clan member to take down 3 Moubu men is a very realistic assumption without exaggeration, when they're taken by surprise and when they're already being dealt with from the front.

You treat the matchups in this battle as if it's a direct confrontation. If it was, i'd lose, i'm playing strategy, and whether it's playing a defensive battle on a shore while the enemies are trying to cross the river or when i ambush them suddenly, i'm having an undoubtful strategical advantage at literally all the battle fields.

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wow ... literally ... wasting GHM ? pure defence? ... i'm lost for words...

I can only tell you one thing, in a battle with the win condition being either reaching an advantage stalemate or defeating the enemy with raw force, with my team, i'd be playing a losing battle if i attempted to win with raw force, hence, i'm going for another alternative.

I don't waste them by using them for defence, on the contrary, i'm having a very advantageous position which i don't wanna abandon, and GHM fortifying the hill is the core of my plan. If i took a complete control over the hill as the battles underneath are still at a stalemate, it'd be my win. there's nothing wrong with playing defensive .

the battles under the hill won't be a stalemate, you left Riboku to the dogs and made him deal with two GGs & 3 HK.

taking the hill would be advantageous if riboku & co went and holed up in there.

[bootleg boy]

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And you're wrong into thinking that Zeno clan is my main attack force; it's to split his attention and dissolve his army which is what i want.

Zeno:
* Ambush the enemy's back at one of the routes drawn in my map with the aim to simply inflict utter destruction.

eh

Well, my start clearly implies that Riboku isn't gonna sit on his ass as he passes through the bottleneck which would take him long enough to reach much less to cross it, much less to do it twice across two bridges actually. Needless to mention, under the 2000 archers on the southern island, and then with the rigid defensive formations of Riboku specifically set to welcome his attack and under the rain or arrows as they cross ... A perfect opportunity for the Zeno clan to inflict an unimaginably great deal of destruction to the army when Moubu could be at the very front leading his way through the bridge making it extremely hard for him to return all the way to the back or attempt to halt a Zeno clan momentum. All when my only aim is to hold his army down until GHM fortifies the hill... that is just impossible to not reach with my commanders.

anyways, this is a mess to read, but if i understand you right; you only have 4k archers deployed to defend the shore and your bridge. the mou bu army is coming from behind them. you'd be crazy to think they'd just ignore your archers after getting past zen ou, or that an attack from a force that small would greatly trouble the mou bu army. mou bu also has mou ten strategizing for him, so it's not as if it'll be as hard for his army to react to your attack as you think.

that said, i really do think ghm will complete his mission to capture and fortify the hill. just don't think ri boku's 100k army will survive afterwards when he ends up sand-witched between ou ki and mou bu.

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everything said, think you had a decent strategy overall. the one biggest and crippling flaw was how you handled ghm and his 36k.

[DreX]

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eh

you're not a kid or an idiot. please don't make regret not spelling it out, it implies the same.

anyways, this is a mess to read, but if i understand you right; you only have 4k archers deployed to defend the shore and your bridge. the mou bu army is coming from behind them. you'd be crazy to think they'd just ignore your archers after getting past zen ou, or that an attack from an force that small would greatly trouble the mou bu army. mou bu also has mou ten strategizing for him, so it's not as if it'll be as hard for his army to react to your attack as you think.

that said, i really do think ghm will complete his mission to capture and fortify the hill. just don't think ri boku's 100k army will survive afterwards when he ends up sand-witched between ou ki and mou bu.

Wow, please re-read my strat.

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everything said, think you had a decent strategy overall. the one biggest and crippling flaw was how you handled ghm and his 36k.

you think you.

[bootleg boy]

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Wow, please re-read my strat.

the one thing i see i was mistaken about is half of your archers are defending a different bridge than what i originally thought

doesn't really make it any better for your situation tho since a 30k strong army is attempting to pass through there

you think you.

i always do

the mou bu army isn't making their way through the southern territory completely unscathed, but they'll maintain most of their strength

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haven't voted yet because i wasn't trying to be hasty, so if you think i missed something that'll convince me otherwise then argue it

but just having me re-read your strat again isn't it

[DreX]

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the one thing i see i was mistaken about is half of your archers are defending a different bridge than what i originally thought

doesn't really make it any better for your situation tho since a 30k strong army is attempting to pass through there



i always do

the mou bu army isn't making their way through the southern territory completely unscathed, but they'll maintain most of their strength

You are honestly mistaken about alot of things first of which the 4000 archers I threw at the first bridge were merely a bait for Moubu to think that he's crossed my defense line before he gets ambushed by Zeno letting down his guard at the back.

I've given Kyoeun over 20000 that's not even the quarter. Putting archers there has a critical advantage there actually as the enemy crosses the river so I also thought it'd be a waste if Moubu crossed without a welcoming gift but I never calculated the damage Moubu will take from that bunny force.

The Moubu army that you speak highly of will be fighting while putting their life on the line there. Please don't say stuff like 'he pincering my army with Ouki' too hastly. For one, they're facing a rigid defense and rain of arrows from the front with Moubu at the front line, and obviously with Zeno clan ambushing them with one third their original numbers. I honestly think that killing three for every Zeno member is too realistic especially when they're taken by a surprise like that by a bunch of beasts and with Moubu busy at the front.

I won't debate GHM further because my point is as clear as day and as long as you're just trying to go back and forth without stepping down or looking at it from a neutral point of view, we'll never reach an agreement

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The main reason why I won't debate further though is that I'm kinda busy with uni work now.






Damn. Escaping reality on this forum is much easier no?

[gn_x00]

from reading the strats, seems like Crispy didn't give Moubu the freedom to chase/attack the enemy before Gyou'un reach the position?

[Void]

you guys really need to proofread these strats and not let things like this slide by

I think Drex has a really solid plan but I'm favoring Crispy because he has smaller armies with better offense while Drex's huge blunder was to force 136k men through that shallow crossing to the island mountain. I think Crispy's gonna make it there first with his more important pieces more ready to do battle. his chances of tearing into Reebok and GHM's army and halting their movement is quite high. Ouki can then signal Moubu to pincer and also flank that big army himself. Akou can arrive unimpeded later to support Gyou'un.

[Crespeh]

[Great Potato]

I don't see the Zenou ambush working out too well, in a normal map perhaps, but the HQs are right next to each other in this one. The Moubu army is holding position right across the bridge, I think they'll be able to notice the bald bandit heading into the woods and it doesn't take a genius to figure out what he might be planning on doing from there.

Drex is saying Zenou is going to strike while Moubu is busy from the front, but I don't see what's meant to hold his attention there, that small handful of archers with no commander? Mouten can be dispatched to take care of that minor threat while Moubu can turn his attention onto Zenou who has to rush all the way out into the open to strike their unoccupied army, who happens to have two commanders giving freedom to delegate one to deal with him.

I give this one to [Crispickle]

End result turns into a battle for the main island, but Drex ultimately finds himself getting pressured and sandwiched from all angles which puts him in a disadvantageous position.

[DreX]

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I don't see the Zenou ambush working out too well, in a normal map perhaps, but the HQs are right next to each other in this one. The Moubu army is holding position right across the bridge, I think they'll be able to notice the bald bandit heading into the woods and it doesn't take a genius to figure out what he might be planning on doing from there.

Drex is saying Zenou is going to strike while Moubu is busy from the front, but I don't see what's meant to hold his attention there, that small handful of archers with no commander? Mouten can be dispatched to take care of that minor threat while Moubu can turn his attention onto Zenou who has to rush all the way out into the open to strike their unoccupied army, who happens to have two commanders giving freedom to delegate one to deal with him.

I give this one to [Crispickle]

End result turns into a battle for the main island, but Drex ultimately finds himself getting pressured and sandwiched from all angles which puts him in a disadvantageous position.

...

When i read something like 'Drex is saying Zenou is going to strike while Moubu is busy from the front, but I don't see what's meant to hold his attention there, that small handful of archers with no commander?'

and then something like this

'finds himself getting pressured and sandwiched from all angles which puts him in a disadvantageous position.'

It honestly fills me with utter disappointment. Now i dont feel like reading Void's post to potentially get cancer.

[Crispickle]

i was blurry last night but for what i could see, drex' strat didn't seem so bad to justify being 3-4 votes behind.

but anyway, i was aware that the only chance drex could take was to aim for the mountain, and that he'd never have tried to engage me on the bridge, so on that part i left the mere necessary for moubu to go on a rampage later. Any other force that isn't moubu's was hence deployed to conquer the third island's foothold, which makes 120k men, so not dissimilar from the 135k drex deploys, but i also think he put more thought in how to "keep" the island rather than how to "take" it, in which regard my strat is more thought out.

moubu eventually triggers when the enemy army basically doesn't think an offensive from there can come anymore, so it'll be a moubu smashing their rear which is one of the most devastating occurrence that one could conceive. Eventually even in drex' best case he undergoes so many losses that his strategists-ruled army is just too crippled to deal with a full ouki army core, especially having one foot in the shallows where they'll end up on.

[DoflaMihawk]

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wow ... I can barely hold myself from replying, but I really want to give you the opportunity to rethink whatever you've just said.

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I do whatever I want

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On a serious note though, we should allow a higher word count for the team that's heavily dependent on strategy more than those on raw power, and that's to exploit the maximum of its potential. if you know what i mean.

Agreed, I think a word count limit would be better than a clause limit.

[Zentos]

Both strats are good.

[DreX]

Wow. the voting period is unexpectedly large isn't it

[DreX]

@Tokio; you've not yet voted Crispi actually depite all the arguments you had with me.

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No one else interested? @Zentos; @gn_x00; @Nordlending; @felixng2015; @Kanki; @Ascot;

[Zentos]

I'm gonna take another look later.

[giantbiceps]

I give this one to [DreX]

Crispy sucks my peepee

[gn_x00]

Overall it's close, but I kinda think crispy wins here due to having more stacked deck.

While GHM will get the hill, Riboku and GHM will have a hard time facing Ouki with people like Gyou'un and Akou in his rank. There's also Moubu who will eventually catch up after he finish Zenou ambush.

[DreX]

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Overall it's close, but I kinda think crispy wins here due to having more stacked deck.

While GHM will get the hill, Riboku and GHM will have a hard time facing Ouki with people like Gyou'un and Akou in his rank. There's also Moubu who will eventually catch up after he finish Zenou ambush.

what the actual fuck ...

If it was that hard for Riboku to hold Ouki with one of ten bows and Kashbikou plus Shin, with an advantageous positioning, for a short while until GHM fortifies the hill, then I've never had a one-millionth chance of winning with my commanders from the very start.

How easy it is to deal with a zenou ambush do you think? how fast will it be?! and how strong will Moubu will be afterwards?! Actually how fast will he cross two bridges, deal with an archery unit over the river, deal with a zeno ambush, to reach the eastern island?!