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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by gn_x00 View Post
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    overall map, which consist of forest and some plain iirc
    had some cliffs too

    I'd say tossup, with slight favoring of Geki. he'd probably see that her being too aggressive would leave his front in tatters but that means he can cut her off kinda like Keisha did to Raido/Zenou so that's a possible route. plus this terrain is really mixed and he has 3 good units who can make the best of it. it all honestly boils down to if he wants to decide this via duel, which he'll lose of course

    Quote Originally Posted by Tokio View Post
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    you must be referring to people on some other site, because this forum has people that think he's comparable to go kei, can beat ghm, and can give kyou a high diff battle
    I'd love for these people to step forward more often then, they've let my boy be unfairly bashed in the past
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  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Great Potato View Post
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    Did you forget Ouki stomping him so hard he was written off as dead immediately after Kyou went down?
    He was shot by like 50 crossbow arrows after Ouki slashed his face...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pirao View Post
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    What?
    In reference to her fight that consisted of only ~2 sides she did some great damage

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pirao View Post
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    What?
    In reference to her fight that consisted of only ~2 sides she did some great damage

  3. #23
    Pretty Flacko Jr. Tokio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pirao View Post
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    Gekishin COULD have been one of Zhao's 3 GH if he had stayed in Zhao.
    honestly, even this is questionable and should be considered in the same vein as gaku jou's hype that he secretly surpassed ren pa. it was just a passing rumor, after all. if he were truly that capable a general then ren pa wouldn't have become bored after ou ki's passing; among other things.
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  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Void View Post
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    had some cliffs too

    I'd say tossup, with slight favoring of Geki. he'd probably see that her being too aggressive would leave his front in tatters but that means he can cut her off kinda like Keisha did to Raido/Zenou so that's a possible route. plus this terrain is really mixed and he has 3 good units who can make the best of it. it all honestly boils down to if he wants to decide this via duel, which he'll lose of course

    I'd love for these people to step forward more often then, they've let my boy be unfairly bashed in the past
    yeah. Personally i create this one because even if Gekishin is below Kyou, he's still packing a good territorial advantage due to the terrain making a good use of his personal units

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Naki View Post
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    He was shot by like 50 crossbow arrows after Ouki slashed his face...

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    In reference to her fight that consisted of only ~2 sides she did some great damage

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    In reference to her fight that consisted of only ~2 sides she did some great damage
    Houken said that Ouki totally destroyed him and he couldn't do anything against him, how did Kyou do greater damage exactly?

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Pirao View Post
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    Houken said that Ouki totally destroyed him and he couldn't do anything against him, how did Kyou do greater damage exactly?
    Well i just watch the panel and see Kyou piercing his torso and slashing his body and again stabbing him the moment he killed Kyou,

    https://mangadex.org/chapter/62959/6
    https://mangadex.org/chapter/62959/7

    while the only damage i see Ouki do is slashing his face. After that he gets shot by like 20 crossbow arrows. The face slash that Houken got like 3 times through this manga is for me more of a symbolic wound thats shows his inferiority in that moment.

    https://mangadex.org/chapter/62959/9
    https://mangadex.org/chapter/62959/10

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Naki View Post
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    Well i just watch the panel and see Kyou piercing his torso and slashing his body and again stabbing him the moment he killed Kyou,

    https://mangadex.org/chapter/62959/6
    https://mangadex.org/chapter/62959/7

    while the only damage i see Ouki do is slashing his face. After that he gets shot by like 20 crossbow arrows. The face slash that Houken got like 3 times through this manga is for me more of a symbolic wound thats shows his inferiority in that moment.

    https://mangadex.org/chapter/62959/9
    https://mangadex.org/chapter/62959/10
    It doesn't matter if Kyou hit him more times. The one time Ouki hit him, he fucked him up, admitted by himself. You're simply arguing against manga canon here, not sure what you're trying to accomplish?

  8. #28
    Yeah, Houken was defeated by Ouki. He found himself completely overwhelmed by a power and strength he could not fathom, that's why he retreated into the wilderness and spent the years training to overcome the gap that existed between them. The scene was meant to showcase that Ouki was above and beyond Houken's weight class at the time, not that Ouki got lucky there were 20 crossbows around to bail him out.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Pirao View Post
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    It doesn't matter if Kyou hit him more times. The one time Ouki hit him, he fucked him up, admitted by himself. You're simply arguing against manga canon here, not sure what you're trying to accomplish?
    I actually argue with panels of the manga, Ouki was just overwhelming Houken with the face slash and showed that he is superior, it was a symbolic finisher move that showed Houken that he was outclassed, he got shot by 20 arrows in the next side of the chapter that sealed his defeat.

    That does not mean i think Ouki could have damaged Houken more than Kyou did, he could and should actually just slice him apart.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Great Potato View Post
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    Yeah, Houken was defeated by Ouki. He found himself completely overwhelmed by a power and strength he could not fathom, that's why he retreated into the wilderness and spent the years training to overcome the gap that existed between them. The scene was meant to showcase that Ouki was above and beyond Houken's weight class at the time, not that Ouki got lucky there were 20 crossbows around to bail him out.
    Yeah i go with everything you say, Ouki could have easily killed Houken. I just say that Kyou did more damage to Houken. And i dont say he needed these crossbowen, just that the physical damage with the head slash wasnt a fatal wound that sealed Houkens defeat. More that it was the symbolic win of the fight.

  10. #30
    Kyou wins, extreme difficulty imo.

    Quote Originally Posted by gn_x00 View Post
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    but above Gokei who pretty much destroy Duke without plot armor?
    eh...does Duke put himself in that danger if he doesn't know that Ouki is there?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tokio View Post
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    honestly, even this is questionable and should be considered in the same vein as gaku jou's hype that he secretly surpassed ren pa. it was just a passing rumor, after all. if he were truly that capable a general then ren pa wouldn't have become bored after ou ki's passing; among other things.
    Renpa lost interest in Ousen remember. Likewise, Ouki wasn't so invested in Gaimou and it wasn't to do with ability. It shouldn't be too far fetched to believe Renpa wasn't so interested in Gekishin's shallow reason for warfare. Plus, Yan and Zhao weren't in as many constant conflicts between Chouhei-Bayou it seems.

    Comparing Gakujoe to Gekishin isn't really fair given that Hara's own words confirmed that the hype was legit. "Most certainly were not an exaggeration" etc etc.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Naki View Post
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    Yeah i go with everything you say, Ouki could have easily killed Houken. I just say that Kyou did more damage to Houken. And i dont say he needed these crossbowen, just that the physical damage with the head slash wasnt a fatal wound that sealed Houkens defeat. More that it was the symbolic win of the fight.


  12. #32
    yup, kyou takes this mid diff at most


  13. #33
    Gokei destroyed Duke... Did I just read that.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Naki View Post
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    I actually argue with panels of the manga, Ouki was just overwhelming Houken with the face slash and showed that he is superior, it was a symbolic finisher move that showed Houken that he was outclassed, he got shot by 20 arrows in the next side of the chapter that sealed his defeat.

    That does not mean i think Ouki could have damaged Houken more than Kyou did, he could and should actually just slice him apart.
    No, you're not, you're just making up an alternative story that never happened. Houken shrugged off Kyou's blows like they were nothing and was standing tall at the end of their fight, Ouki's slash rocked his world completely, made him lose his weapon and fall to the ground. Kyou doing more damage than Ouki is simply false.

  15. #35
    Pretty Flacko Jr. Tokio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kanki View Post
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    Renpa lost interest in Ousen remember. Likewise, Ouki wasn't so invested in Gaimou and it wasn't to do with ability. It shouldn't be too far fetched to believe Renpa wasn't so interested in Gekishin's shallow reason for warfare. Plus, Yan and Zhao weren't in as many constant conflicts between Chouhei-Bayou it seems.

    Comparing Gakujoe to Gekishin isn't really fair given that Hara's own words confirmed that the hype was legit. "Most certainly were not an exaggeration" etc etc.
    geki shin's way of warfare wasn't really any different than gaku ki's, who i believe was respected by ren pa and everyone else. the gai mou example isn't all that valid here in the first place since it was in reference to how they avoided him in a specific setting, and he's not really at a level capable of challenging either of them in an actual war anyways.

    -

    even further, ou ki brought up the names of ou sen and kan ki despite their "faults" solely because he believed them to be at a level capable of challenging ren pa like the q6 once did.

    mou gou then mentioned that ren pa wasn't interested in ou sen because his mind was basically stuck on his own era and the opponents he faced in it. something that seemed to ring home for him since it was emphasized by a flashback conversation he had with ou ki. geki shin was a great general during ren pa's era, so there goes that. there's not much excuse for why he wasn't considered by either ou ki or ren pa other than that he just wasn't up to par.

    also, what hara's words confirmed was the fact that geki shin was really able to emulate gaku ki's style of warfare, not that geki shin was actually z3 or q6 level.
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  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tokio View Post
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    geki shin's way of warfare wasn't really any different than gaku ki's, who i believe was respected by ren pa and everyone else. the gai mou example isn't all that valid here in the first place since it was in reference to how they avoided him in a specific setting, and he's not really at a level capable of challenging either of them in an actual war anyways.

    -

    even further, ou ki brought up the names of ou sen and kan ki despite their "faults" solely because he believed them to be at a level capable of challenging ren pa like the q6 once did.

    mou gou then mentioned that ren pa wasn't interested in ou sen because his mind was basically stuck on his own era and the opponents he faced in it. something that seemed to ring home for him since it was emphasized by a flashback conversation he had with ou ki. geki shin was a great general during ren pa's era, so there goes that. there's not much excuse for why he wasn't considered by either ou ki or ren pa other than that he just wasn't up to par.

    also, what hara's words confirmed was the fact that geki shin was really able to emulate gaku ki's style of warfare, not that geki shin was actually z3 or q6 level.
    i think he means gekishin's reason for fighting (money/greed) clashes with renpa's "rosey" view of war. that's what he meant by the gaimou thing.

  17. #37
    Pretty Flacko Jr. Tokio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Juan View Post
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    i think he means gekishin's reason for fighting (money/greed) clashes with renpa's "rosey" view of war. that's what he meant by the gaimou thing.
    i know that's what he meant. was saying it's a bad comparison for the stated reasons, and the fact that gaku ki was respected despite it.
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  18. #38
    I would favour Kyou here. Gekishin would probably go for a duel and underastimate her which would result in his death. Aside from that I think they are very close but Kyous great offensive and Gekishins arrogance give her the win.


  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Tokio View Post
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    geki shin's way of warfare wasn't really any different than gaku ki's, who i believe was respected by ren pa and everyone else. the gai mou example isn't all that valid here in the first place since it was in reference to how they avoided him in a specific setting, and he's not really at a level capable of challenging either of them in an actual war anyways.

    -

    even further, ou ki brought up the names of ou sen and kan ki despite their "faults" solely because he believed them to be at a level capable of challenging ren pa like the q6 once did.

    mou gou then mentioned that ren pa wasn't interested in ou sen because his mind was basically stuck on his own era and the opponents he faced in it. something that seemed to ring home for him since it was emphasized by a flashback conversation he had with ou ki. geki shin was a great general during ren pa's era, so there goes that. there's not much excuse for why he wasn't considered by either ou ki or ren pa other than that he just wasn't up to par.

    also, what hara's words confirmed was the fact that geki shin was really able to emulate gaku ki's style of warfare, not that geki shin was actually z3 or q6 level.
    I doubt Gakuki was as shallow as Gekishin. Sure he moved there when he was younger, but Gekishin literally has zero loyalty. Purely speculation on my part obviously.

    If Renpa not (openly) acknowledging Gekishin shows he was not on par with the 3/6, what does that say about Kouen? He is from Renpa's generation. Kanmei overlapped as well, yet neither of them were able to inspire Renpa.

  20. #40
    Pretty Flacko Jr. Tokio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kanki View Post
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    I doubt Gakuki was as shallow as Gekishin. Sure he moved there when he was younger, but Gekishin literally has zero loyalty. Purely speculation on my part obviously.

    If Renpa not (openly) acknowledging Gekishin shows he was not on par with the 3/6, what does that say about Kouen? He is from Renpa's generation. Kanmei overlapped as well, yet neither of them were able to inspire Renpa.
    it'd be a stretch to assume that gaku ki had any more loyalty than geki shin when they both betrayed their home stats for money.

    also, the difference is zhao didn't have any real major battles with chu. whereas zhao directly neighbors yan and battles them about as much as they did qin.
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