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  1. #61
    Pretty Flacko Jr. Teo's Avatar
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    wouldn't personally throw out the notion of gyou'un comparing with tou so quickly

    even rei ou had ran bi haku who was comparable to kyou martially(in stats) and even gave tou a challenge iirc.

    wouldn't expect any less from a man who supposedly represented the martial might of one of the great heaven's armies

    - - - Updated - - -

    it's likely he just hasn't been that active since rinshoujou's death

    a good amount of zhao's military this time around seems to be comprised of similarly talented generals that just haven't either been active or are active in areas qin isn't well informed on
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  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Void View Post
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    pretty sure they said Akou was best martial in Ousen's army

    Tou is an exception among exceptions, this guy doesn't look like that
    Different color pupils, cool helmet, and a 10,000 reinforcement commander.

    the looks and hype is good enough




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  3. #63
    Man of 1004 Gifts Void's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elux View Post
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    Different color pupils, cool helmet, and a 10,000 reinforcement commander.

    the looks and hype is good enough

    I personally think the design is lame

    taking the hype with a grain of salt for now though since Hara loves to use fake hype
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  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by Void View Post
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    I personally think the design is lame

    taking the hype with a grain of salt for now though since Hara loves to use fake hype
    Rinshoujou's strongest commander though.

    I'd expect no less a Ranbihaku in him tbh. Considering Rinshoujou is a Great Heaven of Renpa's generation.



    一百万年白日梦冰蚕(1,000,000 Years Daydream Ice Silkworm)
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  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Teo View Post
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    wouldn't personally throw out the notion of gyou'un comparing with tou so quickly

    even rei ou had ran bi haku who was comparable to kyou martially(in stats) and even gave tou a challenge iirc.

    wouldn't expect any less from a man who supposedly represented the martial might of one of the great heaven's armies

    - - - Updated - - -

    it's likely he just hasn't been that active since rinshoujou's death

    a good amount of zhao's military this time around seems to be comprised of similarly talented generals that just haven't either been active or are active in areas qin isn't well informed on
    Tou was essentially Ouki's equal but chose to stand by his side in the shadows. Gyou'un wasn't in the shadow it seems - he was one of two lieutenants and the major offensive force because RSJ was a strategist. That hype is no greater than a 4HK hype tbh.

    Similar to how Batei is the greatest offensive weapon in Kisui's army (though I'm sure Gyou'un is stronger than him).

  6. #66
    King of Heroes Chaos2000's Avatar
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    Wouldn't call Tou as Ouki's equal but yeah he's definitely far above of being a lieutenant. He's essentially the best deputy you can get.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Teo View Post
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    wouldn't personally throw out the notion of gyou'un comparing with tou so quickly

    even rei ou had ran bi haku who was comparable to kyou martially(in stats) and even gave tou a challenge iirc.

    wouldn't expect any less from a man who supposedly represented the martial might of one of the great heaven's armies

    - - - Updated - - -

    it's likely he just hasn't been that active since rinshoujou's death

    a good amount of zhao's military this time around seems to be comprised of similarly talented generals that just haven't either been active or are active in areas qin isn't well informed on
    Gaimou wasn't active for 14 years and he still had 97 strength

    And I expect Gyou un to be at least 95/96

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Stark777 View Post
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    Gaimou wasn't active for 14 years and he still had 97 strength

    And I expect Gyou un to be at least 95/96
    Gaimou was clearly lifting in prison. Since he didn't have any girls to fuck, he had to release all that pent up energy somehow

  9. #69
    Man of 1004 Gifts Void's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elux View Post
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    Rinshoujou's strongest commander though.

    I'd expect no less a Ranbihaku in him tbh. Considering Rinshoujou is a Great Heaven of Renpa's generation.
    yeeeaaahhhhh, I tend to write those off since strongest x of y's army is an isolated statement so the actual quality of said commander could vary considerably, especially considering cross army comparisons.

    seeing as how the star of the left wing has performed and how people are writing off Akou so quick and consistently, I'm skeptical of this guy

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stark777 View Post
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    Gaimou wasn't active for 14 years and he still had 97 strength

    And I expect Gyou un to be at least 95/96
    he had Reiou
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  10. #70
    Heki is a fuckup. that boy needs redemption

  11. #71
    Re-read the chapter - it was said that the martial prowess in his army was shouldered by the Generals - plural. So this isn't really a Ranbihaku situation where the martial power is held in one source. He had more than 1 capable fighter, Gyou'un is just the best. There's no need for him to be a 95/96 tier dude.

    Guys like Gokei or Ousen don't have a dude on that level.

  12. #72
    Pretty Flacko Jr. Teo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kanki View Post
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    Tou was essentially Ouki's equal but chose to stand by his side in the shadows. Gyou'un wasn't in the shadow it seems - he was one of two lieutenants and the major offensive force because RSJ was a strategist. That hype is no greater than a 4HK hype tbh.

    Similar to how Batei is the greatest offensive weapon in Kisui's army (though I'm sure Gyou'un is stronger than him).
    their situation wouldn't have to be similar for their martial acuity to be, there's no real correlation between their strength and disposition here.

    rsj's army has significantly greater prominence than kisui's and the strength of his martial representative would more than likely be proportionately superior.

    great strategists like rei ou or rsj needed their generals to compensate for that lack of strength specifically whereas the 4hk underneath a general like renpa didn't shoulder that duty. because of that greater need for strong generals in an army with a primary strategist as it's head there was likely more competition of strength in those armies. as a result of that, the hype of being the first and foremost amongst all those martial generals likely holds more weight than the 4hk's hype of being the best in renpa's army second to renpa himself; as far as strength is concerned at least.
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  13. #73
    Well... We'll see in next few chapters.. If Ouhon or Akou is struggling defensively, then he might be a real deal with str of 94 or more, but if it's not, then it's just another false hype

    Well you know... We have just got hyped with Bananji in this arc, i don't think his hype is better than Bananji so far.
    At best it is comparable

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Chaos2000 View Post
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    Wouldn't call Tou as Ouki's equal but yeah he's definitely far above of being a lieutenant. He's essentially the best deputy you can get.
    The comparison of being Ouki's equal comes from Ouki himself lol
    Obviously we know Tou is still a tier below Ouki, but the point is he's not really a 4HK like thing.

  14. #74
    No reason for Gyou'un to be above 93 (Rinko) or at best 94 (Ranbihaku). Just look at him- he's Chougaryuu with a face change, he ain't no Tou and he isn't going to be stronger than the Eishi.

    If he fights Akou he'll probably win, but against Ouhon he's definitely jobbing.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Teo View Post
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    their situation wouldn't have to be similar for their martial acuity to be, there's no real correlation between their strength and disposition here.

    rsj's army has significantly greater prominence than kisui's and the strength of his martial representative would more than likely be proportionately superior.

    great strategists like rei ou or rsj needed their generals to compensate for that lack of strength specifically whereas the 4hk underneath a general like renpa didn't shoulder that duty. because of that greater need for strong generals in an army with a primary strategist as it's head there was likely more competition of strength in those armies. as a result of that, the hype of being the first and foremost amongst all those martial generals likely holds more weight than the 4hk's hype of being the best in renpa's army second to renpa himself; as far as strength is concerned at least.
    I know a strategist always has a top martial guy, I just don't think the martial guy needs to be Tou/Duke level. Especially when he apparently has two very capable generals. Imagine RSJ with a guy like Rinbukun being his main fighter for eg. It isn't just Gyou'un either - we've got Chougaryu.

    Gokei didn't have any top tier fighters in his army. That we've seen, neither did Gekishin. Karin is a great fighter (94) but she leads from the HQ, so where is her offensive power? The best fighter under Ousen is Akou, and whilst Ousen himself is a very strong fighter, he doesn't actually make the most of it - It's never really been used, and yet Akou/Makou have been more than enough. Keisha's martial might was with himself (88) and Gakuei (85). Some people say SHK can compete in a huge war, right? Where is his martial beast? He's the best we've seen with a high stat of 90.

    I think my Kisui/Batei/Ryuutou example is viable. Sure, RSJ is obviously above Kisui, but a guy like Rinbukun is also significantly above Batei despite the latter's hype from Mouten.
    Last edited by Kanki; 12-08-2017 at 10:57 AM.

  16. #76
    Pretty Flacko Jr. Teo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kanki View Post
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    I know a strategist always has a top martial guy, I just don't think the martial guy needs to be Tou/Duke level. Especially when he apparently has two very capable generals. Imagine RSJ with a guy like Rinbukun being his main fighter for eg. It isn't just Gyou'un either - we've got Chougaryu.

    Gokei didn't have any top tier fighters in his army. That we've seen, neither did Gekishin. Karin is a great fighter (94) but she leads from the HQ, so where is her offensive power? The best fighter under Ousen is Akou, and whilst Ousen himself is a very strong fighter, he doesn't actually make the most of it - It's never really been used, and yet Akou/Makou have been more than enough. Keisha's martial might was with himself (88) and Gakuei (85). Some people say SHK can compete in a huge war, right? Where is his martial beast? He's the best we've seen with a high stat of 90.

    I think my Kisui/Batei/Ryuutou example is viable. Sure, RSJ is obviously above Kisui, but a guy like Rinbukun is also significantly above Batei despite the latter's hype from Mouten.
    difference between rsj and generals like go kei, geki shin, ka rin, ou sen, kei sha, shk, etc. etc. is; while their strong point is in strategy they're not completely inept in their martial might - most even professing higher proficiency in it than the average.

    geki shin, for instance, was confident he could defeat houken because of his history of slaying bushin and claimed to have the strength of a great general that is beyond reason(was probably even the strongest general in all of yan overall tbh). shk was said to have once been mou bu's superior and still retains much of that strength. ka rin, albeit for a feint, had no issue with leading her army from the front and has a str stat on lvl with kyou. even ou sen has been seen to lead his army from the front despite his preference of leading from an hq. so on and so forth.

    my point was that generals like rsj or rei ou who completely lack any martial ability need more to compensate for that complete lack of skill.

    while it may not be necessary, it's incredibly likely. feel chances of gyou'un being on or near the level of generals like tou are higher than the alternative of him being only 4hk level. especially since rin bu kun level fighters aren't all too uncommon as of late. it probably would be necessary for him to pose a credible threat against ou hon and to separate him in tier from other zhao generals like ba nan ji.
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  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by Teo View Post
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    difference between rsj and generals like go kei, geki shin, ka rin, ou sen, kei sha, shk, etc. etc. is; while their strong point is in strategy they're not completely inept in their martial might - most even professing higher proficiency in it than the average.

    geki shin, for instance, was confident he could defeat houken because of his history of slaying bushin and claimed to have the strength of a great general that is beyond reason(was probably even the strongest general in all of yan overall tbh). shk was said to have once been mou bu's superior and still retains much of that strength. ka rin, albeit for a feint, had no issue with leading her army from the front and has a str stat on lvl with kyou. even ou sen has been seen to lead his army from the front despite his preference of leading from an hq. so on and so forth.

    my point was that generals like rsj or rei ou who completely lack any martial ability need more to compensate for that complete lack of skill.

    while it may not be necessary, it's incredibly likely. feel chances of gyou'un being on or near the level of generals like tou are higher than the alternative of him being only 4hk level. especially since rin bu kun level fighters aren't all too uncommon as of late. it probably would be necessary for him to pose a credible threat against ou hon and to separate him in tier from other zhao generals like ba nan ji.
    Gokei/SHK/Keisha may have some ability martially but they'd still get destroyed by guys far weaker than what you think Gyou'un has to be. I'll use the Rinbukun example again (for the 93) - he destroys Haku Kisai + Kyuugen + SHK, he beats Batei/Kisui, he likely beats Akou, he destroys Keisha's subs. He can be the only source of martial strength RSJ has and it's still brilliant, especially when combined with RSJ's brains. Importantly though, Gyou'un isn't the only source of martial strength. Riboku said RSJ's martial strength is from his generals - i.e more than one. He also has Chougaryu. Gyou'un just happened to be the best.

    Gyou'un (93) + Chougaryu (90) would be more than enough martial ability when you combine them with RSJ. It covers everything. I think this is where people are too easy to hand out high stats again. It happens every single time, and every time the stats come out they're always less than what people predicted. It happened during the coalition war and it happened again a few months ago.

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanki View Post
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    I'll use the Rinbukun example again (for the 93) - he destroys Haku Kisai + Kyuugen + SHK
    Oh huh, SHK's fans incoming.

  19. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by Pirao View Post
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    Oh huh, SHK's fans incoming.
    Bring em on


  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanki View Post
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    Bring em on

    Rinbukun took time to defeat Rokuomi(90) while SHK fodderizes a (90) with two moves.




    一百万年白日梦冰蚕(1,000,000 Years Daydream Ice Silkworm)
    四十万年冰玉皇帝蝎子(400,000 Years Ice Jade Emperor Scorpion Hyotei)
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    Limit Individual, 'The strength to move unhindered throughout the world'


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