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  1. #21
    Either Zhao horses now know shunpo or Makou is deaf

    So was Kisui informed of the plan beforehand or did he just have better eyesight than Makou did?

  2. #22
    Monkey D.Dragon's Avatar
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    Riboku
    Makou

    Shin can't sneak on Kisui because he'll "notice", but Makou didn't notice Riboku coming in with an army sneaking on him

  3. #23
    King of Heroes Chaos2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey D.Dragon View Post
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    Riboku
    Makou

    Shin can't sneak on Kisui because he'll "notice", but Makou didn't notice Riboku coming in with an army sneaking on him
    I guess we now know why he keeps his eyes closed.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaos2000 View Post
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    Ye, if it was, Shin would've already oneshotted both Riboku and Houken with the power of the Hi Shin unit behind him.

    Imagine that

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Tenma View Post
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    So was Kisui informed of the plan beforehand or did he just have better eyesight than Makou did?
    Kisui was told to be an instinctual general. He probably use his instinct to understand that he should stand his ground to help Riboku took out Makou.

    Or even if it's not instinct, it's no brainer that Riboku, who is probably best hyped for his knowledge, will do something instead of sitting around and let his right wing get decimated without doing anything. Almost every readers know that Riboku must be doing something (that's why a lot of people are disappointed when we see the full picture and saw that Riboku army isn't moving at all).

  6. #26
    Riboku the savage

    Now let's see what Mouten and Shin can do to salvage the left flank.

  7. #27
    Cool chapter. I'm guessing Hara will give us a review on how Riboku got to this position. Shame Makou died so early without really showing what he can do but oh well.

    The spoilers on Sunday should be interesting.

    Quote Originally Posted by giantbiceps View Post
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    Shin is the epitome of foolishness in all of China. Abandoning the element of surprise because he's so confident he'll succeed. Riboku should take note of this and loudly announce himself next time he ambushes his enemy.

    If Kisui's head doesn't roll here then Shin will be the laughing stock in Qin and he can forget about becoming general.


    And Hara better explain Riboku teleportation next chapter

    Inb4 Next Chapter
    Re-read the chapter. Shin + Ten felt sneaking would be pointless because they would be spotted, especially since the Kisui army are on the defense and ultra alert to anything (unlike Makou, for eg). Shin hasn't ignored any order and wasn't foolish (this time).

    But lets ignore that and just jump on Shin-hate bandwagon

    Riboku 1-0 Ousen

    Inb4 Woiku arrives and blames it all on Shin somehow.

  8. #28
    ahahahahaha giantbiceps's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kanki View Post
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    But lets ignore that and just jump on Shin-hate bandwagon


  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanki View Post
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    Re-read the chapter. Shin + Ten felt sneaking would be pointless because they would be spotted, especially since the Kisui army are on the defense and ultra alert to anything (unlike Makou, for eg). Shin hasn't ignored any order and wasn't foolish (this time)
    There's still a difference between knowing a new 1000 men army attacking you vs a very well known 1000 men army attacking you. It was actually mentioned by Kisui's HQ how they know it's HSU and pretty much make a better defence compared to if it's just some random 1000 men army

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by giantbiceps View Post
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    Shin is the epitome of foolishness in all of China. Abandoning the element of surprise because he's so confident he'll succeed. Riboku should take note of this and loudly announce himself next time he ambushes his enemy.
    Quote Originally Posted by gn_x00 View Post
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    There's still a difference between knowing a new 1000 men army attacking you vs a very well known 1000 men army attacking you. It was actually mentioned by Kisui's HQ how they know it's HSU and pretty much make a better defence compared to if it's just some random 1000 men army
    The fact is that Shin told his plan and Ten and Kyoukai didn't contradict him, so his decision was the correct one, stop nitpicking.

    Quote Originally Posted by giantbiceps View Post
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    If Kisui's head doesn't roll here then Shin will be the laughing stock in Qin and he can forget about becoming general.


    Suuure.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by gn_x00 View Post
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    There's still a difference between knowing a new 1000 men army attacking you vs a very well known 1000 men army attacking you. It was actually mentioned by Kisui's HQ how they know it's HSU and pretty much make a better defence compared to if it's just some random 1000 men army
    Letting your opposition know that a fearsome attack is coming is also a valid tactic though, if you think you're getting spotted anyway. The HSU are a unit that is fairly intimidating by now.

    If the HSU unit could have sneaked in unnoticed a la Kanki vs Seikai, then yes it would be stupid. This is nothing like that though.

  12. #32
    So now that we've seen that Riboku's plan all along was to upset the left flank, do you think Kisui getting surprised by Mouten and Makou's scheme was legit or he was just playing along until Riboku appeared? Since it appears as if he knew of Riboku's plan and all

  13. #33
    Kisui believing Riboku could/would interfere (either by dialogue between them or instincts) shouldn't detract from his surprise in Makou tbf. He acted surprised with his own men didnt he? I can't remember, but he's not going to lie to them. If he was still casual + chilled then maybe he knew it was always under a level control.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanki View Post
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    Letting your opposition know that a fearsome attack is coming is also a valid tactic though, if you think you're getting spotted anyway. The HSU are a unit that is fairly intimidating by now.

    If the HSU unit could have sneaked in unnoticed a la Kanki vs Seikai, then yes it would be stupid. This is nothing like that though.
    it's a choice between being a unnoticed great force that will smash the HQ in an instant while the enemy is still caught off guard vs a striking force + distraction.

    Yeah, both is a valid choice, but imo, it's going to be much easier to just smash the HQ since they should be the striking force

  15. #35
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    Could it be that Riboku predicted Ousen's 5k troop deployment on the left and already discussed a plan with Kisui to counter it?
    I understood the shock on Qin's side when they were at the strategy table but Riboku's side seemed like a normal deployment (30k 60k 30k). So I didn't get what they were fussing about here:

    Perhaps they wondered why Gyou'un wasn't the commander of the right flank? But those faces would be an overreaction then . The other meaning would be that Riboku told them beforehand that he himself will move out with a detachment.


    - Shin's straightforward plan was the most effective choice but he ruined it with the flags...
    - Makou wasn't confused about Ri....boku so I'm disappointed he didn't even draw his sword...


    Quote Originally Posted by Ichiryuu View Post
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    Umm, just read the chapter, how can Riboku simply run straight towards makou when the battlefield has an overwhelming amount of qin soldiers?! is it because Makou sent his men forward towards Kisui and stayed back himself?
    Hara has a distance (teleportation) problem. He did it in Kokuyou aswell. But tbf, Riboku hasn't been shown since the deployments so a lot could happen in that period.

    My imagination of the current positions are somewhat like this. If correct it may justify Riboku 'appearing out of nowhere' and Makou not noticing.
    Last edited by Saki; 09-08-2017 at 03:19 PM.

  16. #36
    J.Caesar's Avatar
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    Honestly it's this kind of nonsense that keeps
    me from fully enjoying this arc. How entire armies Just just sneak up on commaders like that. Has no one in this entire battle ever heard of scouts? Seriously it feels like slopppy writing from Hara. Makou the imbecile apparently did not think tht the Zhao were not capable of using terrain to mask their armies movements despite the zhao and Riboku in particular having the best horses in China. In any case I think this battle would end up been nowhere the best campaigns and battles in kingdom.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by J.Caesar View Post
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    Honestly it's this kind of nonsense that keeps
    me from fully enjoying this arc. How entire armies Just just sneak up on commaders like that. Has no one in this entire battle ever heard of scouts? Seriously it feels like slopppy writing from Hara. Makou the imbecile apparently did not think tht the Zhao were not capable of using terrain to mask their armies movements despite the zhao and Riboku in particular having the best horses in China. In any case I think this battle would end up been nowhere the best campaigns and battles in kingdom.

    It's funny specially if you look back to Bayou, because even back then, Fuuki had scouts posted that would have detected a mere 100 man unit coming from the center if it hadn't been for Kyoukai's assasinations. Now we have armies in the tens of thousands doing the same and nobody notices them

  18. #38
    lmao i mean seriously what have you guys been reading to say that what Shin did was foolish and he also stated a legit reason for doing what he did unless you guys believe that Kisui would not notice them even with his height advantage and also it would be pretty hard for the HSU to go unnoticed given their destructive strength, and its also not his fault that Makou was not wary of his left flanks being susceptible to enemy'sneak attacks.

    Makou after all that self hype this is how you end up going out, but if there is one credit he deserve is that his were men hyped to be strong by Batei in this chapter.

    Why are people rushing to conclusions about Riboku's sudden appearance without knowing the full picture of how he began his sneak attack and his reason for attacking Makou. And its not like this is a first sudden appearance we have seen in Kingdom, given how it resembles how Renpa suddenly appeared behind Gakujou and his men.
    Last edited by adage; 09-08-2017 at 03:49 PM.

  19. #39
    say-and-sing's Avatar
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    About Makou:
    I get that for the sake of drama, many Kingdom generals don't believe in scouts.

    But this is Makou, one of the hands of Ousen.
    Who leaves his back completely unsupervised in a difficult terrain prone for surprise attacks.
    Which he should know, because this very reason allowed him his own surprise attack on Kisui earlier.

    But I guess five guys with horns are too much to ask.
    At least he didn't flinch.


    About Riboku: @Saki; quite interesting find, their reactions really seem out of place.

    So basically from the beginning Riboku laid in wait for the moment Makou sends his men off to strike his back?
    If so how many people did Riboku bring with him in hiding?

    Too many would risk a reaction from Makou/Ousen, getting the plan.
    Too few and there would be a high chance (normally, as in scouts) of Makou grabbing some elites and greeting Riboku. Unless Riboku knows that proud Makou never watches his back... which seems like a real stretch.

    The downside here is that Riboku's orders will have a huge time drawback to center and other wing compared to Ousen's.
    Plus Riboku vs. Makou is risky as hell, if Makou dies, big problem, if Riboku dies, gg Zhao.


    Basically, the whole chapter hinges on the explanation in the next, which can be either ... or totally awesome.


  20. #40
    J.Caesar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pirao View Post
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    It's funny specially if you look back to Bayou, because even back then, Fuuki had scouts posted that would have detected a mere 100 man unit coming from the center if it hadn't been for Kyoukai's assasinations. Now we have armies in the tens of thousands doing the same and nobody notices them
    I know right. Honestly this entire armies surprising people who should know better is lame on both the Zhao and Qin side. Especially when the terrain seems especially geared towards surprise sneak attacks.

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