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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Void View Post
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    you wanna do it randomly?
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    haven't tought too much about it. It's just a random idea lol
    maybe we can keep people like Bajio, Shunmen, Tajifu to get "Yotanwa's mountain men" to make better sense lol

    although obviously some people have no candidate like Ordo and Gekishin's troops
    Last edited by gn_x00; 06-02-2017 at 05:00 AM.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by gn_x00 View Post
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    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    haven't tought too much about it. It's just a random idea lol
    maybe we can keep people like Bajio, Shunmen, Tajifu to get "Yotanwa's mountain men" to make better sense lol

    although obviously some people have no candidate like Ordo and Gekishin's troops
    Doesn't sound like a bad idea to me I like it IMO.

  3. #23
    got both strats but waiting on Zentos if he wants to add prep since I forgot to remind him like I did with Cyri.

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  4. #24
    Strats:

    @Zentos; is red

    Scouts:
    http://i.imgur.com/TMyU9A1.jpg


    Army paths:
    http://i.imgur.com/CH1MecE.jpg


    Red army – 60k (5k mounted Karin elites, 5k mounted Kouyoku unit, 10k heavy cavalry, 25k cavalry, 15k cavalry archers):
    Karin(CiC):
    - Serve as the CiC and command the armies as a whole, while keeping the communication flowing between the armies, to ensure they discard their pride and be wary of the enemy (especially skilled fighters and archers), as well as follow the intended path (black arrow) and strategy.
    - Lead the red army to attack the yellow base, but in case that no enemies are found there or the scouts report a large group of enemies elsewhere, make preparations to face them where they are.
    - Have the army continue clockwise in case that the enemy is stationed in the green area or turn around if they are at blue.
    Choutou:
    - Protect Karin without regard for your own life and help her manage the armies and communication.
    Kanou:
    - Listen to Karin and Choutou, lead the attack and team up with Ranbihaku and Kouyoku against enemies instead of dueling.
    Ranbihaku:
    - Follow Kanou's lead and team up against enemies instead of dueling.
    Kouyoku:
    - Follow Kanou's lead and team up against enemies instead of dueling.




    Yellow army – 70k (5k bandits, 25k heavy infantry, 18.6k infantry, 20k archers, 1k fast cavalry, 400 Wei war chariots):
    Gokei(ViC):
    - Have the 400 Wei war chariots go to the green area and kick up a dust storm, after which they are to join the yellow army.
    - Lead the yellow army to the intersection, from where they are to move in and pressure the enemy (without being too aggressive) from the back after Karin engages, unless they are defending against an army at the intersection.
    Chousou(ViC):
    - Split the 1k fast cavalry into groups of 200 and send them to scout the 5 orange paths, in a manner where 100 are to return the moment they see enemies, while 100 try to get an estimate of the size, before running back.
    - Help Gokei with leading by taking care of the rear and making sure that at least 10k heavy infantry, 5k infantry and 5k archers are protecting the back at all times.
    Maron:
    - Have your bandit unit split in to smaller units and position them in the forests (brown) where they are to be on the lookout for enemies and instruct them to notify all leaders the moment they see any.
    Kousonryuu:
    - Protect Gokei and Chousou without regard for your own life and help them with communication and leading to the best of your abilities.
    Rinbukun:
    - Stay close to the ViCs and protect them without regard for your own life, while teaming up with Shunmen against enemies.
    Shunmen:
    - Follow Rinbukun's lead and team up against enemies.




    Blue army – 20k (5k mounted bandits, 5k mounted Mouten unit, 3k mounted Futei unit, 7k cavalry):
    Junsou:
    - Lead the blue army through the forest, where you are to wait in order to attack the enemy and help Karin and Gokei after they have engaged them, be it offense or defense, based on your judgement or a request from the leaders.
    Kokuou:
    - Use your bandit experience, knowledge and instinct to help Junsou navigate through the forest and lead the army.
    Mouten:
    - Listen to Junsou and lead the attack, while teaming up with Shoumou and Futei against enemies instead of dueling.
    Shoumou:
    - Follow Mouten's lead and team up against enemies instead of dueling.
    Futei:
    - Follow Mouten's lead and team up against enemies instead of dueling.

    Prep:
    - Karin and the others are to go through the strategy together to make sure all parts work together and to devise a means of communication between the armies, as well as the scouts (both cavalry and bandits alike).
    - Karin and the others are to through military tactics and formation in general, to ensure all battles are fought to the best of their abilities.
    - The red and yellow armies will prepare lightweight spikes/barricades which will be used to protect their rear and/or fortify their position.



    @Cyri; blue

    Distrubiton


    http://imgur.com/a/wQvL8

    Team green(70k troops)
    CiC Yotanwa
    Bajio
    Kaine
    50k heavey calv
    20k mounted archers


    Claus 1 Yotanwa will set up defenses and be prepared for attack in any directions.
    (if the enemy is already in the middle this team will go in to attack)


    Claus 2 Yotanwa will communcate where the enemey armies are to the two other armies
    if found


    claus 3 Team Green will go full defense mode and retreat to Kyou or Tou if they can help.
    if Yotanwa thinks it's needed




    Team Blue(40k troops)
    Vice Tou
    Shin
    30k light cavalry
    10k mounted archer


    Claus 1 they will travel north and slowly around the map trying to find enemey armies. If they
    find any they will blow a horn to let the other two armies know where they are.


    Claus 2 Team blue has no warrior pride Shin and tou will try to fight together


    Claus 3 This team will help green or red group attack a found army as soon as possible


    Team red(40k troops)
    Vice Kyou
    Hakurei
    30k light cavalry
    10k mounted archer


    Claus 1 they will travel east and slowly around the map trying to find enemey armies. If they
    find any they will blow a horn to let the other two armies know where they are.


    Claus 2 Team blue has no warrior pride Hakurei and Kyou will try to fight together


    Claus 3 This team will help green or blue group attack a found army as soon as possible

    prep
    Yotanwa tells Tou and Kyou to use horns for communcation


    The Glorious Fellowship of the Round Jacuzzi:
    https://i.imgur.com/tDbgtsy.jpg

  5. #25
    uhm.. tbh i got a hard time reading Zentos strats...

    can i hope it will be easier with @Crispinianus; corner?

  6. #26
    Crispickle's Avatar
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    I'm in the middle of nowhere half naked

    Sorry


  7. #27
    Mmmm. Beeeer. Zentos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gn_x00 View Post
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    uhm.. tbh i got a hard time reading Zentos strats...

    can i hope it will be easier with @Crispinianus; corner?
    Before I get into any details, I have to explain my maps, since Void refused to put a disclaimer as the host.

    The scouts map should be fairly simple.
    Each orange paths represents 200 fast cavalry (the ones that I got instead of fire bowmen) which search for enemies. As soon as an enemy is found, 100 run back to tell my armies where the enemy is, while the other 100 try to get a number estimate before going back.
    The reason why I had them split like that is to make sure they don't die somehow before at the very least giving info on the enemy location.

    The army paths map is a bit more complex because there's things drawn all over, but it gets a lot easier once you realise that you need to look at 4 separate things.

    The first part would be the brown circles and it's appendages. They represent Maron's bandit unit which is spread in to the forests, in order to prevent any forest ambushes and to serve as a second batch of scouts and means of communication.

    The second part would be the red/blue/yellow army paths accompanied by the big black arrows. The numbers don't represent the order of movement, they represent which arrows go in triplets. What that means is that the red 1 arrow goes together with the blue 1 and yellow 1 arrows. The same goes for the 2 and 3 triplets.
    The numbers may have been an unfortunate decision and I should've used letters instead, but I was really tired so excuse me on that.

    Now to give you a better insight into the actual movement.

    My army starts at blue and head towards the black arrow which points to "1".
    The red army goes along the red arrow, the blue through the forest and the yellow to the intersection.

    I have sent fast cavalry which will move a lot faster than any army (regardless if it's mine or Cyri's) and they will be the first to spot the enemy. As soon as they see Cyri's blue army, they will notify my HQ which will stop in it's tracks and turn around to the arrows that are represented by the arrows "3".

    I forgot about the 400 Wei war chariots (green circle) which will kick up a storm before joining the Yellow army. This should add a significant boon to my side, because my scouts have already found Cyri's blue army, while Cyri won't know what's waiting for him on the other side of that storm.
    Last edited by Zentos; 06-03-2017 at 10:15 AM.

  8. #28
    Mmmm. Beeeer. Zentos's Avatar
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    @Cyri;
    I made a quick sequence before the fighting starts, how does it look?

    Scouts:
    http://i.imgur.com/CFFaH1n.jpg

    Change of plans:
    http://i.imgur.com/gY90WRc.jpg

    Stare down before the carnage:
    http://i.imgur.com/J2cXl5h.jpg
    ______________________________________________

    My view:

    Junsou has the clause to help Karin and Gokei, but it doesn't look like Karin will be needing any, which means that my blue army will be heading towards south, in order to flank your Yotanwa army.

    My yellow (Gokei) army has the clause to defend the intersection, with the help of the lightweight spikes and barricades. I believe they'll be fine holding out until my blue (Junsou) army flanks Yotanwa. Karin and the red army will be joining as well, after they finish up on north.

  9. #29
    Uh.. I'll try to vote tomorrow when I get Internet in my pc.

    Using my phone is too confusing, and i need to go out because signal is bad in my place

  10. #30
    Form what I gather, Zentos looks to have the early advantage with his fast scouts but kinda wastes that by going to one first. He can turn his army around but that is kinda counter productive. I can say Cyri's Tou army will be good in power but with numbers they'll be hard pressed once Zentos' bandits get in place. He's actually going to be the decider of this match, because of whether or not he can kill Karin. Yotanwa meets Gokei and they're about even but Yotanwa gets massive help from Kyou with the southern pincer. So Gokei looks to be in a tough spot that I don't think he'll be able to get out of in due time while Tou is also in a tough spot and lacks officer quality while being pressed from two directions.

    I'm leaning Cyri atm but it's pretty much even.

    - - - Updated - - -
    @Nordlending; @Aliasniamor; come vote
    Quote Originally Posted by Crispinianus View Post
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    I'm in the middle of nowhere half naked

    Sorry
    I always knew you wanted to join the Yotanwa army

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  11. #31
    Mmmm. Beeeer. Zentos's Avatar
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    @Void;
    How exactly is Tou not beaten by the red army alone? You're not being objective at all here.
    He's going in with 40k vs 60k, with 5k being Karin elites + Kouyoku unit + heavy cav and all the officers that are stacked there, while most of his army is light cavalry.

    My blue army won't be going there, they'll be going south to help Gokei, because Tou is getting trashed by my red army alone. Or is Tou now a better general than Karin that's getting advice from Choutou, so he'll be fine with worse quality and quantity?

    Gokei also isn't really in a tight spot, the forest passages are narrow, he's not getting hit by huge numbers. He has heavy units, lightweight spikes/barricades and he's playing it defensively, while my blue army is flanking Yotanwa.
    Last edited by Zentos; 06-03-2017 at 09:57 PM.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Zentos View Post
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    @Void;
    How exactly is Tou not beaten by the red army alone? You're not being objective at all here.
    He's going in with 40k vs 60k, with 5k being Karin elites + Kouyoku unit + heavy cav and all the officers that are stacked there, while most of his army is light cavalry.

    My blue army won't be going there, they'll be going south to help Gokei, because Tou is getting trashed by my red army alone. Or is Tou now a better general than Karin that's getting advice from Choutou, so he'll be fine with worse quality and quantity?

    Gokei also isn't really in a tight spot, the forest passages are narrow, he's not getting hit by huge numbers. He has heavy units, lightweight spikes/barricades and he's playing it defensively, while my blue army is flanking Yotanwa.
    Tou held out against Karin in the manga with worse odds, he's not getting beat in a forest path from one direction when his defense survived a plains 3 direction assault. If it comes to it, Tou can take on Ranbihaku while Shin can hold Kouyoku and Kanou on the frontlines. You're the one not being objective.



    He's being pincered by two armies that combine for more of his own and they don't have the specification to keep strictly to the paths for a flank.

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  13. #33
    Mmmm. Beeeer. Zentos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Void View Post
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    Tou held out against Karin in the manga with worse odds, he's not getting beat in a forest path from one direction when his defense survived a plains 3 direction assault. If it comes to it, Tou can take on Ranbihaku while Shin can hold Kouyoku and Kanou on the frontlines. You're the one not being objective.
    That's only because he wasn't her objective, she just had to get her elites to the other side. Even when she had the clear chance to take his head, she left and went to where Kanmei was.
    He also had Mouten and Ouhon save his ass with their intelligent flanking, Shin ain't doing that.

    Kanou, Ranbi and Kouyoku have team up clauses, you're not splitting the 3 of them up.

    Why are we even bothering with different units if they aren't worth shit?
    Cyri has:
    10k mounted archers vs my 15k
    30k light cavalry against 25k normal cavalry
    and on top of that I have 10k heavy cavalry, 5k Karin elites and the 5k Kouyoku unit.

    Not only do I have better numbers, the quality of my troops is massively ahead. It's not even fucking funny, I bet 5k Karin elites and the 5k Kouyoku unit would fuck up 30k light cavalry on their own.
    He's being pincered by two armies that combine for more of his own and they don't have the specification to keep strictly to the paths for a flank.
    Nope, that's not going to work. He's drawn a path where they will be going and the forest ain't it. You can't just assign a new strat to his army like that. Their paths are drawn and they will follow them.


    Apparently Gokei can't hold out with 65k + 20k flanking vs 110k, while defending 2 narrow forest paths with barricades and spikes, but Tou is just fine attacking with 40k vs 60k with a massive disparity in quality. Yeah, extremely objective.
    Last edited by Zentos; 06-03-2017 at 10:51 PM.

  14. #34
    i still can't get a good grasp on where some of Zentos' team are... so hopefully Zentos and Cyri can confirm this:

    i'll divide on 3 path overall (north, centre and south), the right battlefield should be empty since no one is there at all.

    North Path
    Tou army 40k (Shin) vs Karin 60k (Ranbihaku, Kouyoku, Kanou)

    Centre Path
    Yotanwa army 70k (Bajio) vs Gokei 70k (Rinbukun, Shunmen) + reinforcement from Junsou 20k (Mouten, Shoumou, Futei)

    South Path
    Kyou army (Hakurei) 40k vs no one

    So, Zentos will find the enemies pretty quickly in all 3 path. Tou will be the one who find enemy first in Cyri's side, especially with Yotanwa not going out initially (but soon since she can see the enemy in the center and see the scouts).

    Tou vs Karin army is a bit hard. While the numbers are not as bad as the manga, Karin army has better equipped with elites and she has more mid tiers to help. Whlie Tou might be able to fend of Karin since it's easier than the manga, Karin will definitely make use of the forest to her advantage. Tou will also be busy in the "duel" of Tou + Shin vs Ranbihaku + Kouyoku + Kanou. Giving the north path to Zentos' advantage

    Yotanwa vs Gokei army. The dust chariots doesn't really matter much since Yotanwa will move after she see the enemy. While Yotanwa will find it hard to press Gokei and Chousou, the battle here will tilt to Yotanwa's army favor once Kyou arrive to attack Gokei's flank.
    Junsou will try to help to even up the odds, however it will be 110k vs 90k in a two way battle. Giving the centre-south to Cyri's advantage because Cyri has better generals in this battle.

    tbh not sure how it will end....
    Last edited by gn_x00; 06-04-2017 at 12:21 AM.

  15. #35
    Mmmm. Beeeer. Zentos's Avatar
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    @gn_x00;
    How did you forget about 5 of my generals?

    You can use this image for reference, it's how thing should look before the fighting starts:

    http://imgur.com/J2cXl5h

    Junsou will lead the blue army from there to press Yotanwa's army, who's up against the defending Gokei. Don't forget that Gokei has spikes and barricades to reduce the impact of any charges. The fact that it's not an open plains battle, but rather a defense of narrow forest paths, goes in his favour as well.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Zentos View Post
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    @gn_x00;
    How did you forget about 5 of my generals?
    i don't really think the need to mention them since they are quite redundant with all the higher ups deciding things anyway

    You get too much generals lol

    How is Junsou there? He needs to go to Point 1 first right?
    Then before the fight starts he should be behind Gokei and will ended up fighting with Kyou army to help Gokei

  17. #37
    Mmmm. Beeeer. Zentos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gn_x00 View Post
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    i don't really think the need to mention them since they are quite redundant with all the higher ups deciding things anyway

    You get too much generals lol
    They may not be in charge, but they are additions either way, both for strategy and manpower. We might as well just have the GGs and strongest brutes and play with them only, if you want to put it like that.

    How is Junsou there? He needs to go to Point 1 first right?
    Then before the fight starts he should be behind Gokei and will ended up fighting with Kyou army to help Gokei
    No, they don't follow the order...I made that huge post explaining it, did you read it?

    The numbers represent triplets (red 1, blue 1, yellow 1); (red 2, blue 2, yellow 2); (red 3, blue 3, yellow 3).
    Karin has the clause to go to yellow, but if the scouts report enemies to be elsewhere, she needs to change their direction. If the enemy is at blue, turn around and apply the "3" triplet, if the enemy is at green, apply the "2" triplet.
    Junsou has the clause to help either army, which will obviously be Gokei in this case.

    However, Gokei has the clause to pressure the enemy Karin is fighting only if he's not defending the intersection, so he won't be moving from the intersection.

    __________________________________________

    The way that I see it, now going in to the details a bit further. Once again, as seen in the before-the-fight image:

    http://imgur.com/J2cXl5h The "7k" at Junsou (blue) army is 7k cavalry, the text got cut off.

    Battlefield 1: The open fields in the north
    Tou army vs Karin army

    Tou has no clause to be extra wary, defensive or anything of the likes. He will engage in a fight (not claiming reckless charge, but still, a fight) where he is facing 2:3 numbers and a massive disparity in quality. Mind you, this is light cavalry against normal and heavy cavalry supported by one of the best elites in the world and another special unit.

    If Tou had any kind of fortification, protection or minimal casualties clause, I would consider that he'd be able to hold out for a decent amount of time. However, since that isn't the case, I don't see how he's supposed to survive the onslaught that he is facing.

    Battlefield 2: the center Intersection
    Yotanwa army with Kyou army support vs Gokei army with Junsou army support

    If we were talking about an open field battle, surely my Gokei army would suffer a decisive loss. After all, he is facing 110k with only 65k himself.
    Luckily, Gokei is not going to face 110k at once, but rather, whatever number may be fit in the forest passages. Not only that, he will be reducing the impact of their charges with the spikes and barricades that have been prepared beforehand.
    That's not all, however, since a 20k strong army is going to hit Yotanwa in the flank and reduce the pressure on the Gokei army by a significant amount.

    It is my firm belief that a total of 85k men defending two fortified forest paths against 110k men will hold out significantly longer than 40k fighting 60k in an open field, with a massive quality disparity, no less.
    Last edited by Zentos; 06-04-2017 at 11:38 AM.

  18. #38
    man... you made such a confusing strats... please make it easier to read in the future.

    fair enough, with Junsou in that position, it will be much easier for Gokei to defend. He'll take even harder burnt from Kyou that i imagined since Junsou won't be supporting there, but in the other hand he should be able to handle it just fine with Yotanwa which has the bigger army getting flanked. Not sure how Yotanwa will "retreat to Tou or Kyou position" according to clause 3 since from the path, it looks hard to do. Plus she has the bigger army which will make it harder for her

    Gokei with Chousou and other general support only need to defend in a (quite easy) terrain to defend, while Karin will eventually winning her clash vs Tou.

    [Zentos] except if Cyri can debate on why his position is better
    Last edited by gn_x00; 06-04-2017 at 12:26 PM.

  19. #39
    Crispickle's Avatar
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    I'll come home today, somehow.

    Hopefully it'll be in time to vote


  20. #40
    Mmmm. Beeeer. Zentos's Avatar
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    @gn_x00;
    Well, it's a really fun map and I didn't want anything boring...plus I'm really busy lately and I had to write it after a really long day, so some things weren't written as clear as they could be.

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